Episode 137: Discovering your “Big Thing,” a conversation with author Jeff Patterson.

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Natalie Tysdal

Well, I love it when the podcast goes full circle. And this is really fun for me to get to interview someone that I've known for a very long time but haven't spoken to until I saw that he was an author. And helping people achieve their goals and find their big thing. And I've been following him on social media. So I'm reconnecting today with Jeff Patterson. Jeff, what a pleasure it is to have you here.

Jeff Patterson 

Same here, Natalie, so great to see and be with you.

Natalie Tysdal

Well, when I say full circle, everyone, Jeff and I went to college together in Nebraska, many mutual friends and lots of fun memories and things back from Nebraska days. But both of our lives have taken a different turn probably than what we expected when we were in journalism school in Nebraska. Tell us a little bit about yours.

Jeff Patterson 

Yeah, well, I originally came out of school focused on being in front of the camera. Thought I wanted to be in news and eventually sports broadcasting and how to show on ESPN two. And that helped me launch into Nickelodeon, hosting a couple kids shows for them, three, in fact, which launched me into the world of Hollywood. And of course, I always wanted to make an impact and help millions of people, you know, inspire them to do their big thing and really be who they want to be in this life.

And I thought that was the trajectory. I thought that was how I was going to get it done. And then as time went on, I wasn't having as much fun. And the business became something other than the dream that I was holding. And that was a very challenging time, but ultimately it woke me up to my true calling. And that's what most of my work is spent doing now, is helping people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world to actually do it.

Natalie Tysdal

Well, so your book, which we're going to go into, what you discuss in the book, and that really is finding your big thing. And similarly to your Hollywood story, for me, for many years, 28 years in the news business, and I thought it was what I was supposed to be doing, but I just wasn't fulfilled. Everybody said, oh, it's so glamorous. How could you leave this awesome job? And I knew I didn't want to spend my life just telling sad stories that people instead of inspiring them.

Jeff Patterson 

Yes, yes, you know, it's, I think there's always, you know, the future is always being created in the now through our attention or focus. And so it's hard sometimes to make those pivots. It's hard when you don't know what to do and you certainly don't know how to make a change to stop and go, you know, to clarify what you want to do. But it's so important, even if you know where you're going, to stop, to pause, to really get in touch with what's driving you, with...

Jeff Patterson 

why you want to do what you want to do to make sure that we don't turn around in 10 years and go, oh my gosh, I'm not doing what I really long to do. And sometimes it takes an event to wake us up. And, you know, I'm a big proponent for slowing down and getting clear on that now so that you can really be in alignment with it.

Natalie Tysdal 

Can we, let's talk about that for a minute because slowing down, I find, and I think I'm like a lot of people, that slowing down is scary. Like slowing down is, oh no, if I continue to go fast, then I don't have to deal with things. Like just keep myself busy. And our world pretty much requires that we stay busy. So in coaching people and helping, and I know by the way I should mention, you graduated with a journalism degree and then you went on in a master's in psychology, correct? Yeah, so let's talk about that slowing down thing.

Jeff Patterson 

Yes, that's correct.

Jeff Patterson 

Yeah, well, the slowing down isn't necessarily slowing your body down. It's slowing the mind down. And most of us are so bombarded with inputs, interference, distraction. And it's, it's become commonplace for many of us, myself included. It's so easy with, especially with social media and slowing down is creating space. It's not jamming your schedule so tight that there's not a moment to catch your breath and reflect. And it's so important to slow that down and put into place a system that creates space for you to not be thinking, to not be taking in anything. There's meditation, there's all kinds of practices, but it really starts with creating space and that's counter to a very engaged world that we live in.

Natalie Tysdal 

What does that look like? I was talking to a friend just the other day and she was saying that her therapist told her to go to yoga and she said, I hate yoga because I have to be mindful. I have to stop. And I said, oh, I relate to that. I can't be multitasking when I'm doing yoga. And I do the same thing if I go on a walk. I like to be, I like my mind to be busy. Why is it important that we create that space and

What does that space look like? Give me examples.

Jeff Patterson 

Well, I'll give a specific example. This is an actual activity that your listeners or all of you listening right now could actually apply. I talk about this in the book called Feel the Feelings. And the essence is to simply pause, and you can do this for one minute, you could do it for 10 minutes, you could do it longer, but for many people that struggle with meditation, this is a simple way to ground you and bring you home.

So what that looks like for me is anytime I feel anxiety or any tension or anything going on in my body, be that emotional or just physiological or physical even, I use the sensation to ground me and bring me home into the present moment. So if you're listening and if you're not driving an automobile or in a place where you can be safe, just pause for a second and if you can, you can close your eyes or not,

Be in your skin for a second and breathe. And as you do, notice some place in your body where you might feel tension or just sensation. Maybe you feel a little tension and a tingle in your chest. If you do, let yourself feel that sensation rather than pushing against. Allow, welcome like a child on your lap with emotions or a sensation.

Jeff Patterson 

Let it be there. Let go of the mind and just bring your attention to it and let yourself feel it. Like an alien slipping into your body to see what it's like to be human. Just feel it and then breathe and just feel that sensation. And if you do that even for a moment, what usually happens is the sensation dissipates or leaves it all together.

Natalie Tysdal 

Keep going, you were about to say something important.

Jeff Patterson 

Well, I wanted to just share, I wanted to give something specific because it doesn't take a long time and this is one of, if there's one thing I could give every business owner out there, it would be this particular relaxation exercise because this is the opposite of what most of us are doing in American life. We don't feel what's going on in our bodies. We think about what's going on in our bodies and then we unconsciously resist it.

Jeff Patterson 

We run from it and that's what leads us and makes us prone to busyness. We don't wanna feel it. So we get busy, we look at our social media or we get active. So this one thing, I've seen this eliminate anxiety disorders. I've seen it change lives. Just this one simple thing. So that's one thing it could look like. It could look that simple.

Natalie Tysdal 

Wow. I think that's really huge. We try to push through it. It's that, oh, just push through it instead of allowing ourselves to feel it. That's very, very cultural. That's very American. I don't know if other cultures do that too, but it's really just push through it. Move on to the next thing. Distract yourself. All of that.

Jeff Patterson 

Yeah, and then when I let myself feel the sensation, then I'm actually present enough to ask, what am I thinking? Like what thoughts are driving this sensation? And usually it's thoughts that are just floating around that we hold as the truth. You know, thoughts aren't dangerous unless we actually believe them. And so that's the other thing about space is to focus on something other than the tape running in our head.

That could be as simple as taking a walk for five minutes and focusing on everything that you see is beautiful. It's really, it can be that simple. And I've had to be that uber simple because meditation has been very hard in my past. I couldn't do it. It was very challenging. And then I just found little hacks and that's kind of, you know, 20 years ago, what led to me coaching a lot of people. They're like, how do you seem so sane in the world of Hollywood or in business later on?

Jeff Patterson

And it's just, I created these hacks in ways that really helped me to connect to a part of myself that is not just my thoughts and the kind of physical human experience.

Natalie Tysdal 

Yeah. What I think is really cool about your story is that here you are in Hollywood and people start noticing these hacks, things that you were doing. They start asking you, can you help me? And that you saw those doors opening and you just kept walking through them, as I like to say. And it led to a whole different career. What does that look like? And I know you do coaching, but what is that? Who is that? Actors, leaders, entrepreneurs, and what are the problems you most often see with them?

Jeff Patterson 

Well, most of my clients are founders of large companies, but they're also people who are committed to making a significant change to make the world a better place. And so, you know, they're at the top of their field in many cases, definitely at the top of the chain in their organization. So, you know, I'm helping them really challenge themselves.

Jeff Patterson 

I love helping people who are already very successful and what many would say are at the top of their game to bring out a new level in their performance and really within themselves, which delivers in business and ultimately makes changes in society. So to me, that's a very intuitive process, part of that. And the other parts aren't as intuitive. Of course, I put in the book, The Big Thing Effect, that really helped people ignite powerful transformation regardless of how successful you've been.

Natalie Tysdal 

What are the biggest issues with the successful people who run big companies? Is it anxiety? Is it not slowing down like you mentioned before?

Jeff Patterson 

Yeah, they're so good at getting things done and great at delegating, you know, when they get to that level. And sometimes they lose the fire, that same feeling that motivated them. Plus, you know, as you know, life changes, you grow as a human being and life happens. And then sometimes some of that life can convolute or get in the way of us feeling like we're on top of our game. And so it's so important to continually, you know, clear the screen and bring out parts of ourself that are dying to come forward. And that's a continual iterative process. Just like a company needs to iterate and continually find new ways to serve their customers, we've got to find new ways to bring forward parts of ourself, greater wisdom, greater acumen, and bring that passion forward. And there are ways to do that. But it doesn't happen in the day-to-day task-oriented life, especially that of somebody who's extremely busy.

Natalie Tysdal

Yeah. When did you know you were going to put, you're busy, I know you're busy with your coaching business and thank you for taking the time with me. But when did you know you were going to put all of that into a book and how did you put that together?

Jeff Patterson

Well, I've probably known that a long time for several decades, because I've wanted to have a way to share so much of what I feel and have helped people with over the years. And this message of what's your big thing has really been there since the beginning, since I was very little. And so what had me turn it into a book was I felt like I needed a couple decades of applying this in very high stakes, you know, with people that are really utilizing it. And I had to apply it in my own life for a significant amount of time to to really be a product of it, as well as be a facilitator and leader of it. So I hit a level of that, you know, expertise in my business to where I felt like there were plenty of stories. And then the experience I had on the mountain where I almost died and.

Jeff Patterson 

went through that entire experience. That catalyzed it all. It was sort of like the story that brought everything together. So that's what really, on top of that mountain, is when I really decided this is going in a book and it's happening now.

Natalie Tysdal 

So often, and myself included, we have to go through a life changing, a struggle to see what our big thing is. But I tell people who don't know, I know they can grab the book, but tell people what happened on the mountain and how did that change you.

Jeff Patterson 

So I was invited to join a group of seven men to climb Mt. Aukankakwa, one of the highest mountains in the world, the highest in the world outside of Asia. We trained for a year and I had very little climbing experience. But why I chose to do it was because I was also at a point in my career and my life back in 2009 where I felt like I was playing it safe and settling for good instead of really converting on the potential that was

in me. And I felt like I just kept thinking, you know, I'm not ready yet. I'm not ready yet. And I didn't like that response in me. And when, when I was asked, I originally said no. And then I said, yes. And it became this quest to not just learn how and climb this mountain, but really to become that guy, the adventurous guy, the guy that doesn't let excuses or money or fear get in the way of

Jeff Patterson 

inner change that I wanted to create. I wanted to shift my way of being. So that had me say yes. And then we trained for a year and then ultimately went to Argentina to climb this incredible mountain, a mountain that many people die on. It's nicknamed the Mountain of Death because a lot of people have lost their lives on this mountain.

Natalie Tysdal 

Well, that's scary. And you accomplished it.

Jeff Patterson 

Well, yes, I did make it to the top of the mountain and back. I did. And the book opens up on summit day where after 14 days on the mountain, having slept about 10 hours and lost 15 pounds at that point, just, you know, in the process of getting up to 19,200 feet on the way to 20, 2,851 feet, we were at a very dangerous part of the climb called the Windy Traverse. And our team had gone farther ahead of me because they were much faster than me. Plus I had severe altitude sickness. And a man fell off, not from my team, but from another team. He was in front of me and I watched him trip and bounce off the side of the mountain and fall a thousand feet. And I was just frozen staring at his red suit below. And it was surreal because I was probably looking for any excuse to turn around and boy, death is sure a good one. I was of course concerned about him. It was obvious that this was fatal. I mean, you just, but, and as I stared at his lifeless body, you know, I just, I saw my own life. And

Jeff Patterson

I was just overcome with this feeling of, first of all, compassion for this man and thinking about his family and what he left behind, but then thinking if that was me, what would I have left behind? Had I done what I came into this life to do? Had I become all that I was capable of being? And my honest answer in my heart was no. And I decided that I was gonna continue to the top of the mountain, and to at least as best I could. It's not a guarantee there was still about 2000 feet yet to climb and a short window to do it. But most importantly, I, that dream in my heart to really make that difference and to share this story along with the many principles that I've been wanting to put in a book and share with a broader audience than just my private clientele. You know, that was my big thing that was born on that mountain.

And I promised myself, I made a promise to life that when I got off the mountain, whether I successfully summited or not, that's exactly what I was gonna do.

Natalie Tysdal 

Yeah, big awakening. And we all have those moments when we allow them to happen and change us, for sure. So the big thing effect, how do you advise people? And if you're gonna give people tips here today, in a half an hour, how much can we really teach? But I know there are things that we can inspire people with even more. How can you advise someone to find if maybe they feel like I'm stuck in a rut. I feel like you were before. How do I know my big thing?

Jeff Patterson 

Well, first of all, it's important to know that you have a big thing. Everybody's got one. I've yet to meet a human being that was at least, you know, let's say at least 10 years old. I've never met anyone that didn't have one. But sometimes it takes a minute to slow down and explore it because we're again, so focused on achieving or taking care of our family or being busy or there are plenty of important.

Jeff Patterson 

responsibilities we all have. And I'm not suggesting that we not show up for those. But the first step is to realize you've got one and it's dying to come out. And if you clarify it, it doesn't mean you have to disrupt your current life. In fact, it will give greater focus and it will give greater meaning to your current life because you'll know what you're really heading toward that is essential. So the first step is acknowledging that you've got one and committing, just deciding.

I'm going to clarify my big thing. And you could take 30 days to clarify it. You could take three months. You could set out and say, the next six months, I'm going to do certain things that I know will help me to step off the hamster wheel to get clear. I'm going to maybe engage with a coach or a therapist or somebody help me. And I'm going to clarify my big thing. Because just clarifying it.

Jeff Patterson 

and I talk about this in the book with lots of stories. Just clarifying your big thing will unequivocally, unequivocally, sorry, unequivocally, just invented a word that didn't exist. It will change your life. Just clarifying it will change you.

Natalie Tysdal

Good word. Do you think that big thing continues to change?

Jeff Patterson

Yes, I mean, I would say yes to that, but at any given precipice of your life, if you pause and explore, it'll be there. There will be one. And yes, in many cases, it iterates and shifts. But in my case, the big thing was always in there, pure and clear. I just...

Natalie Tysdal 

or evolve?

Jeff Patterson 

would only let myself see a certain amount of it because I didn't know how to contextualize it.

Natalie Tysdal 

Yeah, yeah. The fear of failure, I think, keeps so many of us from pursuing it. It's like, I don't really want to admit that's my big thing because then first I have to work towards it. And if I fail, I don't, you know what I mean? I see that off. I do that. I think a lot of us do. I work with high schoolers now. I mentioned this to you. And it's so life-giving to me in a way I never even saw or thought possible. And I don't know that that's my...

Jeff Patterson

Yeah.

Natalie Tysdal

big thing, but I really enjoy it. I feel like I'm giving back in a different way. I love high schoolers, but I think that they don't know what their big thing is. They don't. What I often see is, but Mrs. Tisdall, it's so funny that they call me that, it makes me feel old. Mrs. Tisdall, I don't know what I want to do. I don't know where I want to go to college. I mean, think back to when we were in college. You just feel like there are these expectations on you.

Natalie Tysdal

And I don't necessarily think that a big thing has to be a big public thing. Your big thing could be very private. It could be actually a small big thing, but it's your thing.

Jeff Patterson

That's right.

Jeff Patterson

Yes, I'm glad you said that, you know, because I'm careful, because in certain sectors, this conversation could really be misconstrued and could be over, it could be misconstrued as all about achieving and all about, you know, an external oriented focus. This is actually the opposite, even though we are saying what's your big thing. So to, you know, to mention that, especially with, you know,

Natalie Tysdal

Yeah.

Jeff Patterson

The big thing is really about listening to the thing that inside of you is really calling you. And that means disconnecting from the world out here and doing what everybody else says you should do or what your career says you can do. You can listen to that, but that's the challenge most people have. They're stuck up here. And we're what I would say spiritual beings having a human experience, not the other way around. And most people are trying to leverage their humanity, trying to do something.

Natalie Tysdal 

Yes!

Jeff Patterson

otherworldly, when you gotta leverage the otherworldly, you know, your spirit, your intuition, your instincts, and a lot of these factors that are not just of the mind that we learn in school. And when you fashion the world around those, then you take that skill and you elevate it. So it's so important, especially with young people, is to give them permission to listen to what they love and start with what you do know. You know, when I was in high school, I remember, because I wrote a letter to myself.

Jeff Patterson 

And the letter was where I thought I would be in 10 years. And you know what? Pretty spot on. Yeah, I need to go get that letter. It's been a while since I've opened it again. But at the time, I was listening to people and really instinctually helping people to frame stories. I thought I was gonna be an advertising executive that really helped.

Natalie Tysdal 

Oh, really?

Jeff Patterson

products and people to really reach mass audiences and do what they wanted to do. But at the core of it, what I loved doing was a creative process of helping somebody really break through. So I knew I wanted to collaborate with people. I knew I wanted to use my instincts. I knew I wanted to use my creativity and my big thinking mind to help people see more for themselves. That's always been a constant. So I think...

I think a lot of kids and people really know deep down what they love. They just can't figure out, well, what do I do? How do I leverage that? How do I create a career out of that? That's part of the process of exploring, but you can't know the answer to that before you start. That's why most people don't start. It's just too vague and too wide.

Natalie Tysdal

Yeah, I completely agree with that. It's, you have to start and just get started and not be afraid to dream. There's again, like that fear, that word of fear is such a big deal. Well, give us a couple, before we wrap up, give us a couple of other tips, pieces of information or inspiration from the book that people can take home today. Maybe something, I like to give them something they can do today to help themselves.

Jeff Patterson 

Well, the first thing is feel the feelings, the one we just talked about a moment ago. The second thing is, is oftentimes when we're exploring what's my big thing, we don't look at who we want to be in our future. We're so focused on what we want to do that we forget who is it that I want to be? What do I want to feel? The difference I want to make? You know, what's my essence?

Jeff Patterson

How do I want to show up in the world? And a number of years ago, I had a major life breakthrough before the mountain. And I was in a career, not even in a career, I was really in a job to help me while I was in Hollywood.

I was selling cars at Honda of Santa Monica and I was really struggling because I had such judgment on myself. What kind of loser sells the used cars and all the judgment and where I thought I'd come in my life to have to support my income. And I was like, do I continue with Hollywood? Do I go full time into coaching because I was part time in those days back in the late

Do I go into sales? Something that everybody said I was good at. And I was exploring the question, what's my big thing? Although I didn't have those words for it at the time. I was stuck. And I could not get clear on what I wanted to do. And this is what I think hangs many of us up. So if you're hung up on what your big thing is right now, ask this question, who do I wanna be?

And most of us, if we're not clear on what we want to do, can pause and imagine a future a couple of years out, imagine a future where you're actually being and experiencing what you want to be and experience. When I was at that dealership, I had no clue what I wanted to do, but I knew I wanted to be generous. I knew I wanted to use my instinct and intuition to help others break through and go for what they really wanted in life. And I knew that I wanted to be

vibrant and strong and healthy. And those were things that I wasn't doing in that job. I was doing what I thought I needed to do to sell cars. And so I wrote that version of me down. What does he focus on? What are his core beliefs? What quality does he exude in spades? And what habit does he always do? And I created this little kind of...

Jeff Patterson

character study of the future me, Jeff, 10 years in the future. And then I played a game. I'm like, you know what? Rather than trying to figure out what I'm going to do, I'm just going to be that guy here at the dealership. And it changed my life. I shot to number one in sales.

I was asked to build an arm of this company, something that I didn't think I had any experience of. I built the fleet department of this business, the first online arm of this company that I'd ever done. I got really clear that I wasn't going to stay in this business. I got clear on the direction I wanted to go. It all happened because I got clear on who I wanted to be.

Natalie Tysdal

I love that.

Jeff Patterson 

I talk about this in the book. I give a specific roadmap along with some stories of me as well as clients, how to systematically clarify and then execute on a new way of being.

Natalie Tysdal

Yeah, that's so beautiful because we do get so caught up in the achievement side that we stop when you stop and you say, that's just not the person I want to be. That's where I found myself is I just didn't want to be feeding people negativity every day. And I just I love that. And it's also just letting go of an expectation of achievement.

And for me, that's my faith. God's gonna take care of this. If I just stop and I allow him to, and I say, I'm gonna live in this moment of who I, like you've said, I've never put it in those words, of who I wanna be, how I wanna help people. Like for right now, working with high schoolers, doing this, encouraging people, the doors will start opening.

Jeff Patterson 

Yes, beautifully said, Natalie. And I would, you know, on the heels of what we just said, everyone listening, if you're wanting to clarify your big thing, it's the same thing I would share with you, Natalie, from what you just mentioned. I would take a period of time, 30 days, three months, and decide that you're going to clarify your big thing and set out to do it and put 20 minutes a day. Whatever you do inside of that's up to you. However, I would start with what you know you love and finish this sentence, what I know about my big thing is dot dot dot, and just keep repeating that sentence and writing it down. For example, you mentioned teaching and helping others find their way. Your communication and sharing that with people. Obviously, you're brilliant at it, you put the career on that. There's so many things that we know about what we want, we just can't figure out. What to do with it and how to do with it. And that's how it starts. Just get all the things that you know are a part of it and focus on that. Don't worry about what you don't know and start there.

Natalie Tysdal 

Yeah, yeah. And stop putting such big expectations on yourself. Oh my goodness. I see that with young people probably more today than ever is this expectation of immediate success. Like I had kids that would come into the TV station and say, I want to be the anchor. And I'd say, well, that's good, but let's start with videographer and producer and what, oh, but it's just this expectation of I got to get here quick. You know, maybe it's that immediate gratification.

Natalie Tysdal 

I'm not sure, but we have to slow down and say, that might not be your path. And that's okay. But to give yourself grace and take it slow. Enjoy the time in the middle.

Jeff Patterson

Yeah, exploring the passion, what you really want, you know, whether it's an expectation or whether it's a commitment, you know, for most people, they just haven't been given permission to really sit with the desire and explore what they really want and why they want it, what that's about and who that allows them to be. And so that's why I take a lot of time with people to really understand at a cellular level, what this...

Jeff Patterson

what this vision, what this dream really is. It's one of the things I'm really good at. I can smell it in people. I can help pull it out very quickly and then reflect what I'm hearing back, which helps the iterative process to happen very quickly or much quicker than we would maybe fumbling on our own. But I can hear some wonderful things in what you're sharing, Natalie, the teacher, the communicator, the inspirator.

Jeff Patterson 

you know, and I would encourage you because I think everybody needs this encouragement, myself included, is you more than likely know what it is. Give yourself permission. You won't know how. You know, a big thing, you deeply want to do it. It scares you. You may think it's impossible. You can't do it alone. It must serve others than just you. And...

Natalie Tysdal 

You need help doing it. You know, there's seven real clear markers and you're not crazy for being scared. And most people are gonna be really, you know, their mind's gonna tell them this is dangerous and you shouldn't do it.

And that's probably the thing you should be doing. Yeah, I love that. You're not crazy if you're scared. Because if it scares you, then that's, I love that. I've always believed that if it scares you, then that's probably where you need to be going. But maybe not. I don't know. I just think it's beautiful.

Jeff Patterson 

Well, yeah, I think that, you know, going for it, yes, always. That doesn't mean you make it your career. I think that's the challenge. And as you were talking before, the pressure we put on ourselves, take the pressure of the, you know, of your big thing, making money for you right now. Who's to say it has to make money. I've coached people who are, you know, well-known CEOs whose big thing was actually something very small, very small, but it was very meaningful.

And had specific impact that was really meaningful and made a huge difference, saved lives. But it was not the scale that they were used to. And so that's the courage is to listen to that impulse that's talking to us and it's always talking to us if we'll listen. And it will then, that's what usually, you know, really surges people ahead in their business. You start saying yes to your big thing. Now that aliveness that's permeating the big thing is gonna...

Jeff Patterson 

infiltrate everything that you do. And that's the big thing effect.

Natalie Tysdal

That's wonderful. Okay, so the book is full of all this information. Tell people where they can get it. I'll be sure to put it in the show notes, but where can people find it?

Jeff Patterson

You can find more about the book and this movement at AspenSuccessCoaching.com. And you can get the book on Amazon, Barnes and Noble. You can get it on Audible as well. The big thing effect, it's winning some awards, so it should be pretty easy to see if you just Google it. But my website, Amazon and Barnes and Noble are the fastest, best places to get it.

Natalie Tysdal

I'll put a link again in the show notes. Jeff, it's so good to catch up with you. I'm so happy for you. And by the way, Jeff's up there in Aspen here, not far from me in Colorado, beautiful spot. And I know you're helping people though all over the world because we've got this cool technology we can do that with, which is pretty great.

Jeff Patterson 

Yes, well hopefully our paths cross and we get to see each other sometime soon. Nice to be reconnected and thanks for the amazing work you're doing in the world. I love it.

Natalie Tysdal

Thanks, Jeff. All the best to you and your family.

Jeff Patterson 

Thank you. You too, Natalie.